I’m glad you enjoyed the article. To answer your questions: I chose this type of battery instead of LiFePO4 mostly because of the cost and convenience. LiFePO4 is a bit more expensive and has fewer options for cells. These Li-ion cells are a bit less expensive and there are dozens of options with many different specifications for any power/capacity need. I’ve used and built LiFePO4 packs before and they have their own unique advantages, but for me they just don’t add up to enough.
Almost all consumer electronics that have a plug-in charger these days are powered with lithium batteries because they can store about 3 times more energy than NiMH. Small devices like cell phones, mp3 players, and other gadgets typically have lithium-polymer packs, as these can be formed in conveniently shaped thin rectangular pouches. Larger devices like laptops and the new lithium cordless power tools generally use cylindrical Lithium-ion cells of a size smaller than a ‘C’ but bigger than a ‘AA’. These are spot welded in series/parallel combination to give an appropriate voltage and capacity for the job.
The purchase price is often a turnoff for many people, but in reality $200 for a good hobby-level spot welder isn’t bad. All together, the supplies for my first battery, including the cost of the tools like the spot welder, ending up costing me about the same as if I had bought a retail battery of equal performance. That meant that in the end I had a new battery and I considered all the tools as free. Since then I’ve used them to build countless more batteries and made some huge savings!
Ideally, I would buy a battery with the same type of connection and just carry the spare one unconnected and swap them over but I don’t seem to be able to find the type of battery case for sale anywhere. It’s a quick release bottle type battery that has two sprung terminals about half inch in diameter that contact with two large terminals on what I think must be the motor controller integrated into the bottom of the bottle mounting bracket.
Offset packing results in a shorter pack because the parallel groups are offset by half a cell, taking up part of the space between the cells of the previous parallel group. However, this results in a somewhat wider pack as the offset parallel groups extend to each side by a quarter of a cell more than they would have in linear packing. Offset packing is handy for times where you need to fit the pack into a shorter area (such as the frame triangle) and don’t care about the width penalty.
Great article! Have ordered everything BUT i have a big problem with the spotwelder. Most homes in europe are limited to 10A and this spotwelder alone drags 15A just to powerupp!!!! I can even start it without blowing both fuses! And when welding it wants 50A-800A which you need a an actual POWERPLANT for!
And a final point is that a larger battery has a lower per cell stress during discharge, since the current is shared among more parallel cells. Cells that are cycled at high discharge curents (>1-2C) also exhibit lower cycle life than those cycled at low currents
craig it should not damage your controller. When you connect two batteries together in parallel it will actually extend the life of both batteries because you are not taking as much of a toll on them when discharging and hopefully not running them down as low.
At the same time though, think about if that is what you want. It could be that those cells died because of a malfunctioning BMS unit or old wiring. Putting new cells in their spots could just wind up killing those new cells in a few days or weeks. I’ve seen that happen as well. So make sure you check everything and consider all of your options!
I bought a triangle pack in March 2016…. I reported the issue to EM3ev and they were very concerned. Asked me to do a few tests and it was determined that the battery had a faulty BMS….. They did a replacement pack with upgraded batteries for free….. I …
I have an old 12V DC Brush Motor which its consumption is around the 12A, 13 A and I built a Battery pack, with two groups of batteries, (4S6P)+(4S6P), which makes a total pack with 14,8V 30A. To make this battery pack I used 18650 Samsung Cells 2600 mAh.
I like to cut most of my nickel strip in advance so I can just weld straight through without breaking my flow to stop and cut more nickel. I measured out the width of three cells and cut enough nickel strip to weld the top and bottoms of 10 sets of 3 cells, meaning 20 strips of nickel that were each 3 cells wide, plus a couple spares in case I messed anything up.
Now this step is very important: I’m going to turn the pack upside-down and perform this set of welds between the positive caps on the second parallel group and negative terminals on the third parallel group. Essentially, I’m welding on the opposite side of the pack as I did when I connected the first two parallel groups. Skip down a few pictures to see the completely welded pack to understand how the alternating side system works.
Lithium electric bike batteries are not cheap, they are not perfect, and they are not readily available. Some OEM’s such as BionX sell a moderately sized lithium e-bike battery pack for $1000 plus. Optibike sells their touring LiPo battery as an add-on accessory for their bike for a gasping $2500. It is surprisingly difficult to find a ready to plug in LiPo battery pack for sale on the internet by any real company. The reason is simply product liability.
A High-performance Motor acheives a top speed of 20-30km/h with a range of 20km means your ebike commute just got easier. 36V 8AH Lithium-Ion Battery. Motor: 36V 250W brushless. Rang: 18-25km(36v 6ah)…
Motor: 36V 350W brushless motor. · Lithium Battery— The removable 36V 10AH Ion lithium battery, equipped with smart lithium battery charger can make you ride up to 32kms. And lithium battery could a…
A quick note: when you get into large sizes of heat shrink, the method of quoting the size often changes from referring to the diameter of the tube to referring to the flat width (or half the circumference when in a circle). This is because at these large sizes, it’s not so much a tube anymore as two flat sheets fused together, sort of like an envelope. Keep that in mind and know what size is being quoted when you buy your large diameter heat shrink tube.
Yes, as I understand it, Nimh and NiCd batteries charge differently. I understand lithium batteries much better than those other technologies, so don’t quote me on this, but I believe that Nimh and NiCd cells have current powered through them and the voltage control is different, as opposed to lithium cells that draw current at the charger’s preset rate and then keep drawing until the voltage floats to 4.2V, at which point the already tapering charger’s current supply is cutoff and the battery is fully charged.
Test the voltage of each cell to make sure that they are all identical. If your cells came straight from the factory, they shouldn’t vary by more than a few percentage points from one to the next. They will likely fall in the range of 3.6-3.8 volts per cell as most factories ship their cells partially discharged to extend their shelf lives.
Do you have any charts showing the different weights by voltage for lead acid vs lithium? It would be good info to be able to see the penalty paid for cheap lead acid in a mid level build when compared to the equivalent lithium setup.
Safety disclaimer: Before we begin, it’s important to note that lithium batteries inherently contain a large amount of energy, and it is therefore crucial to handle them with the highest levels of caution. Building a DIY lithium battery requires a basic understanding of battery principles and should not be attempted by anyone lacking confidence in his or her electrical and technical skills. Please read this article in its entirety before attempting to build your own ebike battery. Always seek professional assistance if needed.
Also I wanted to “hide” the batteries in the Brompton frame aligning the batteries in file, I understand it would not have a long range but would be quite stealthy. If you http://electricbikeframes.com any recommendations please do tell me
Yes! We are hoping that is why you bought it! However, if your eBike has a Lithium-Ion based battery, it is best not to fly as Li-Ion Batteries are considered hazardous materials and can land you a $50,000 fine if you try to bring it on an airplane.
In 2012, the future of LiPo in e-bikes looks bright. Most large EV manufacturers are focusing on LiPo as the lithium battery power of the future. LiPo technology is developing fast and becoming safer, more reliable, cheaper, and with a higher life expectancy. Since LiPo cells are being developed to be safer, more efficient and more economical (mostly for main stream products such as the automobile) the electric bicycle industry will be able to piggy-back and utilize the newly available technology at an affordable price. Currently, the latest “best” chemistry involves Manganese-Cobalt which is a lot more stable than the cobalt chemistry of the past.
Having built a 13s4p battery to the best of my ability and hooked it up to my 48V 1000W ebike conversion kit…. the lights on the throttle turned on and the wheel spun! Initially I thought the project was a success but after mounting the battery and controller onto the bike and taking the bike for a test spin I ran into a major problem.
Of course, if you go really fast or are pulling an extra load, then this mileage will be worse, like 12-15 wh/km. On the other hand, if you use the motor more sparingly, then you can easily stretch it down to 6-8 wh/km. The table below summarizes the expected range for these different batteries under light, average, and heavy usage paradigms:
Do you by any chance have some spare parts you can swap in? A spare controller would you let you know if the controller is faulty and tripping early. Another battery would show you if the problem was battery related.
Recently the federal goverment has been cracking down on the shipping of lithium batteries. For the vendor, it means that they must have Hazardous Materials (hazmat) shipping and pay hazmat charges, and only can ship an officially tested hazmat-compliant battery. This adds considerably to the cost of lithium batteries, and makes it even harder to find an ebike dealer, who will sell you any lithium battery pack that they can affordably source.
Remember, if a battery with a certain chemistry can “survive” at 2C, it may actually last much longer if it is sized so that the amp-draw from the controller/motor is only 1C. If it can actually be run at 2C, but it dies in a month with daily use…and yet if sized to run at 1C it lasts a year? Legally the manufacturer is not lying by calling it a 2C battery. There is nothing wrong with that, but…we here want E-bike customers to be aware of the real-world results so they can make an informed decision, and avoid the disappointment that could turn off a lot of potential E-bikers to a wonderful sport and hobby.
i have the exact same BMS but i only have 6 cells, 2p x s3 , i have 2x 3.7v @ 2000 mah batteries in parallel connected to another 2 parallel batteries in series and another parallel pack in series if that makes sense to make a total of 11.1 v @ 12mah for a small project. [redirect url=’http://electricbikebatterys.com//bump’ sec=’7′]